E-Mail This Article to a Friend Right, and wrong (continued)

Q: You write about taking back morality. How do liberals do that?

A: We focus on the central moral failures of our era, which are in boardrooms rather than bedrooms. The scandals on Wall Street and in large companies continue. There has been no real reform. Executive compensation is out of control, now 500 times the average worker’s compensation, whereas it was a small multiple 10 or 15 years ago. Money from the rich and from corporations is flooding politics. These are moral issues, and should be discussed as such. We need to regard them as shameful.

Q: Why don’t we, or why haven’t we?

A: I think that liberals and progressives have been a little bit afraid of morality, perhaps because the moral club has been wielded so effectively by the right against individuals engaging in their personal, sexual lives. But we’ve got to separate private morality from public morality. What happens between two people, two consenting adults, is not the public’s business. But when the captains of industry defraud investors, fire thousands of employees, pollute politics with campaign contributions, and loot their companies, that undermines our entire system. That’s publicly immoral.

Q: Talk about the historic parallel that makes you believe another era of liberalism is coming.

A: There’s a striking parallel with the first years of the 20th century. In 1900, the gap between rich and poor was wider than it had been at any point in our nation’s history; immigrants were flooding into our cities; the United States was engaged in imperial war; politics was a cesspool of patronage and kickbacks; it looked as if American democracy and liberal, progressive values were in eclipse. But then something very strange happened: the public began to fight back. Some of this started at the state level, [with] progressive governors like Robert La Follette in Wisconsin; states like Oregon and Minnesota pioneered new laws on wages and hours; women demanded the vote; a progressive income tax was enacted; regulations were imposed on food and drugs; muckrakers, we called them, journalists informed the public of what corporations were doing, and also of the plight of the poor. America’s conscience was pricked, and we rolled up our sleeves and decided to change the direction we were heading in. The result was an outpouring of reform legislation, culminating in the New Deal. Average Americans couldn’t abide what was going on and decided to take the country back.

Q: What are your predictions for November?

A: John Kerry will win.

Q: What do you think the consequences for this country will be if he doesn’t?

A: Another four years of George W. Bush would mean that the radical conservatives in the administration are unleashed. The only constraint they’ve felt is having to be re-elected. Without that constraint, the warriors may well feel that it’s time to go into the rest of the so-called axis of evil, including Syria and North Korea. Our civil liberties will be curtailed, with what’s called Patriot Two, the second Patriot Act. The Supreme Court will be packed with anti-abortion judges, and abortion rights will be gone. There will be further tax cuts for the wealthy — in fact, they’re already planning them — and the gap between the rich and the rest will widen accordingly. Environmental regulations will be gutted and business interests will essentially run the country. I’m not painting an unrealistic picture, and I’m not being an alarmist. This is what we will get.

John Kerry, on the other hand, can’t alone lead a progressive revival in this country. Hence another purpose in writing the book. People have to get involved. The country has to get mobilized and energized. The day after Election Day and the days following are just as important as the days leading up to Election Day. Kerry can be a great president if he has the people behind him.

Q: What do you say to people who say they just can’t get excited about Kerry?

A: I tell them they better start getting excited. That a vote for Ralph Nader is in effect a vote for George W. Bush. If they didn’t learn that in 2000, shame on them. That John Kerry has a decent chance of beating Bush, but only if we get mobilized and energized between now and Election Day. But I also tell them that John Kerry will need, like every president needs, to know that there’s a strong public behind him, pushing him in a progressive direction.

Q: What’s next for you?

A: I will be helping the Kerry campaign, which I have since he announced [his candidacy]. I’m a professor at Brandeis; I have a lot of teaching ahead. And I have another book project coming up. It’s about leadership and social change.

Q: You’ve got a full plate.

A: It sometimes seems too full. Much of my job over the years has been public education, whether I’ve been secretary of labor or an author or a professor. It’s all about helping the public understand what’s at stake.

Robert Reich reads from Reason: Why Liberals Will Win the Battle for America at the Charles Hotel, 1 Bennett Street, in Cambridge, on June 22, at 7 p.m. Call (617) 354-5201. Tamara Wieder can be reached at twieder[a]phx.com